{"id":662,"date":"2018-06-19T18:13:26","date_gmt":"2018-06-19T22:13:26","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.w3nd.org\/?page_id=662"},"modified":"2021-09-01T11:50:26","modified_gmt":"2021-09-01T15:50:26","slug":"digital-atv","status":"publish","type":"page","link":"https:\/\/w3nd.org\/?page_id=662","title":{"rendered":"Digital ATV"},"content":{"rendered":"

Digital ATV Activity<\/span><\/h1>\n

Most up to date info can be found at the following:<\/p>\n

Mid Atlantic ATV <\/strong>page on the groups.io web site.<\/strong>
\nhttps:\/\/groups.io\/g\/MidAtlanticATV<\/strong><\/p>\n

A summary of info will be kept here.<\/p>\n

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The SBE Central Pennsylvania Chapter 41 Ennes Workshop on \u201cTransitioning to ATSC 3.0\u201d<\/strong>
\nPost seminar discussion:<\/strong><\/p>\n

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August 31, 2021:<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n

With the requested software changes, this could be a great way to combine multiple antennas into a single receiver. No need to worry about cable lengths, phasing, or impedance matching harnesses. On the receive side of a repeater, you wouldn’t need to use an omnidirectional antenna wasting coverage and adding interference. You could point a couple of yagis in different directions at specific locations of interest – where the ATVers are, population centers, etc. – and combine those antennas into one receiver.<\/p>\n

Food for thought . . .<\/p>\n

Dan Rapak – WA3ATV<\/span><\/p>\n

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As is, it will handle a CATV Ch. 60 signal on the cable input spigot, filter it and apply AGC and amplify it for distribution.<\/span><\/p>\n

If they make the requested software changes, it will take 438-444 on an antenna input, filter it, apply AGC and allow you to convert it to a standard broadcast frequency allowing any off-the-shelf TV to tune it. It will do that for any format the TV is capable of receiving, including NTSC.
\nOn 8\/31\/2021 7:30 PM, Dave Stepnowski – KC3AM via groups.io wrote:<\/p>\n

Sorry I could not attend, what a bummer.<\/p>\n

Sounds interesting for those who have a digital system.
\nFor those of us with analog it doesn’t seem to be worth anything.
\nAlthough within Dan’s text here he does say any format so does that mean it will receive 439.250 AM,CATV 60, just as is?<\/p>\n

Dave KC3AM<\/p><\/blockquote>\n

Dan Rapak – WA3ATV<\/span><\/p>\n

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Rich,<\/span>
\nOn 8\/31\/2021 8:47 AM, Rich Reese – KR3EE wrote:<\/p>\n

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My thoughts.<\/div>\n
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As an attendee to this seminar, I was excited to see this product, and at such a low price.\u00a0 In a very brief conversation with Javier, I also inquired about coverage for the amateur bands.\u00a0 I would also promote extending them to 1300 Mhz, even if the output drops off.\u00a0 Perhaps a software patch can perform this task.<\/div>\n
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Over the weekend I downloaded the instruction manual and checked it\u2019s technical specifications.\u00a0 This has lead to another question.\u00a0 If it strips the carrier frequency and modulates the transport stream back on a new carrier, what modulation is the output?\u00a0 I suspect that it is \u201cwhat comes in is what goes out.\u201d<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n

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It does NOT do a demod-remod. The signals are never converted to base band audio or video. It digitizes the incoming RF<\/i> waveform and performs DSP, much the same way SDRs perform their filtering functions. In this case, it filters, applies AGC and if desired will frequency shift. But this all occurs in a digitized RF domain. So yes, what goes in is what comes out, just cleaned up and AGC’ed. If you feed it a DVB-T signal on the input, a DVB-T signal will come out. It cannot<\/i> translate from one modulation scheme to another. Think MATV system: a bunch of antennas feeding a bunch of filters and individual channel amplifiers with AGC and possibly one or more channel converters, all of which get combined together into one amplified output.<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n

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When setting up an MATV\u00a0 systems, all of the outputs need to be of the same type so that the scan function on the TV tuner accepts every channel.\u00a0 In the short term, operators could be receiving signals OTA from ATSC 1.0 and ATSC 3.0 sources plus various cable feeds and maybe even DVB-S from satellite.<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n

That depends on the TV set. I have an LG that can maintain both<\/i> cable channels and off-air channels in it’s channel list at the same time. If I was able to receive an NTSC or ATSC 1.0 amateur televison signal here, I could put it’s cable channel number in the set’s channel table and punch it up along with the broadcast stations.<\/span><\/p>\n

Dan Rapak – WA3ATV<\/span><\/p>\n

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My thoughts.<\/p>\n

As an attendee to this seminar, I was excited to see this product, and at such a low price. In a very brief conversation with Javier, I also inquired about coverage for the amateur bands. I would also promote extending them to 1300 Mhz, even if the output drops off. Perhaps a software patch can perform this task.<\/p>\n

Over the weekend I downloaded the instruction manual and checked it\u2019s technical specifications. This has lead to another question. If it strips the carrier frequency and modulates the transport stream back on a new carrier, what modulation is the output? I suspect that it is \u201cwhat comes in is what goes out.\u201d<\/p>\n

When setting up an MATV systems, all of the outputs need to be of the same type so that the scan function on the TV tuner accepts every channel. In the short term, operators could be receiving signals OTA from ATSC 1.0 and ATSC 3.0 sources plus various cable feeds and maybe even DVB-S from satellite.<\/p>\n

Now if I am wrong and the device can translate this stream to a difference modulation standard, then we have found a very affordable DVB-T \/ ATSC 3.0 modulator and receiver which would also permit reception of analog NTSC, digital ATSC 1.0, or DVB-T on the same receiver and without switching and being able to pass them through to the modulator. Basically a repeater in a box ! [Assuming we can program co-channel outputs.]<\/p>\n

By the way 55 dBmv is +13 dBm or about 20 mw available to drive a power amplifier; I believe that the HiDes 320E is +5 dBm max.<\/p>\n

Rich Reese – KR3EE<\/p>\n

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Yep. At the SBE NextGen workshop, one of the speakers put up a map showing ATSC 3.0 coverage. Expected to be 30% of the country expected to have at least one station available by the end of the year.<\/span><\/p>\n

More than three dozen NextGen TV sets now on the shelves from LG, Samsung and Sony.
\nhttps:\/\/www.crutchfield.com\/shopsearch\/nextgen_tv.html?&pg=2<\/a><\/p>\n

This is rolling along faster than expected!<\/p>\n

On 8\/31\/2021 12:03 AM, Mark Thompson – WB9QZB via groups.io wrote:<\/div>\n
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ATSC Annual Meeting Focuses on 3.0 Rollout | TV Tech<\/span><\/b><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
\u00a0<\/b><\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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https:\/\/www.tvtechnology.com\/news\/atsc-annual-meeting-focuses-on-30-rollout<\/b><\/span><\/a><\/pre>\n
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Dan Rapak – WA3ATV<\/p>\n
August 30, 2021<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n
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All,<\/p>\n
The SBE Central Pennsylvania Chapter 41 Ennes Workshop on \u201cTransitioning to ATSC 3.0\u201d was held this past Friday, August 27th. The speakers did an excellent job of presenting the fundamentals of the new, NextGenTV standard for over-the-air broadcasting in the US approved by the FCC just a few years ago. The workshop was very well attended, including members of our Mid-Atlantic ATV group; Gary Black – WA3CPO, Jeff Elliot – W3JVU, Rick Reese – KR3EE and myself – WA3ATV. As one would expect there were also several other ham operators among the broadcast engineers, so our hobby was well represented.<\/p>\n
One of the speakers was Javier Ruano of Televes USA who spoke on the various pieces of test equipment broadcasters will need to maintain a top quality NextGenTV signal. For those not familiar, Televes makes both broadcast quality and commercial (hotel, hospital, bar, etc.) grade MATV equipment. They are a European company that has been around for decades and has a good reputation. Here I need to stress that I have no relationship with Televes, no financial interest in their products and nothing to gain by passing this information along.<\/p>\n
Having said that, one of the items in particular that caught the attention of those of us from the DATV world is a device called the AvantX \u201cHead End in a Box.\u201d<\/p>\n
This is a remarkable device that takes signals from up to four off-air TV antennas, plus an FM radio antenna as well as a CATV input all at the same time! It processes the signals digitally (much like a wide-band SDR.) The box filters out the LTE signals that were dropped into the middle of the UHF television band and then provides up to 32 individual, programmable filters that can be applied to the inputs independently. The output of each filter then has AGC applied to it. The output of each filter can then be individually frequency shifted to another physical channel! The output level is up to +55 dBmV which makes it suitable for use as an MATV distribution amplifier. The box can do all of this from 54 to 1220 MHz. All of this is in a rugged package that is less than 3-1\/2\u201d x 2\u201d x 1\u201d and it is NOT made in China! If this were being done with traditional cable TV processing amplifiers, channel filters, combiners and converters it would take up several racks and would cost thousands of dollars. This box? $400 on Amazon!<\/p>\n
What really caught the attention of us ATV guys was the ability to filter and frequency shift individual channels. After the workshop I spoke with Javier at length, asking whether the box could frequency shift channels outside the standard US television channels into a US television channel. I explained that ham operators were using frequencies in the 420 to 450 MHz and 902 to 928 MHz for digital television and the ability to filter and frequency shift signals in those bands would be very useful in ATV applications. I asked Javier whether the box could do that. His answer was no, not a present (the channel selection can only be made by channel number and CATV channels cannot be shifted) but he felt it would simply be a matter of a software change to add that capability.<\/p>\n
Today we exchanged a few emails. Seeing a potential niche market for the product he has submitted the idea to the Televes R&D department to see what the feasibility might be. The question is whether there would be enough of a market to make the software alterations worthwhile. If this feature were added, it would be possible to filter, shift and amplify any ATV channel – no matter what format – to another frequency. It would, for example, be possible to shift your local analog or ATSC 3.0 ATV Repeater to a standard off-air TV channel, mix it in with signals you are receiving by antenna or by cable TV and watch it on any set in your household, watch it on multiple TV sets in an Emergency Operations Center or on multiple sets at an ATV demonstration.<\/p>\n
If you think this is something you might find useful, here is a link to a pdf of the AvantX product sheet:
\nhttps:\/\/www.televes.com\/downloadfile\/PLA11200000_TUSA_76038.pdf\/L_AVANTX_532180_EN_USA_PLA11200000.pdf<\/a><\/p>\n
If you\u2019d like to see the AvantX have the ability to frequency shift channels in the ham bands to regular TV channels and filter ATV channels and would like to add your voice, feel free to pass along your thoughts to Javier Ruano at:
\njruano@televes.com<\/a>
\nMention that you received information about the AvantX on one of the ham radio lists and are curious as to whether it can shift channels in the ham radio bands of 420 to 450 and 902 to 928 or something to that effect.<\/p>\n
Maybe this is not something members of our niche hobby are in fact interested in, but if it is I suspect Javier could use the additional ammunition to convince his R&D department to go forward with the software change.<\/p>\n
Personally, I will eventually purchase one these for my home, software change or not. I can receive signals from several TV markets and have been looking for a cost effective way of combining the signals from several antennas into one MATV stream. This box fits the bill rather nicely.<\/p>\n
Please feel free to share this info with any other ATV lists you may be a member of.<\/p>\n
73,
\nDan Rapak – WA3ATV<\/p>\n
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June 28, 2021<\/strong><\/span><\/p>\n
All,<\/p>\n
Below is an announcement about a really terrific opportunity for anyone interested in learning the basics of the new ATSC 3.0 digital over-the-air broadcast transmission standard. The Society of Broadcast Engineers Chapter 41 (the Central Pennsylvania Chapter) is hosting an in-person seminar to introduce broadcast technical personnel to the new format. The seminar is intended to cover the basics and is also open to non-SBE members<\/i>.<\/p>\n
The presenters are very high caliber. They are some of the people involved in developing and rolling out the new standard. If anyone can explain what’s going on, these are the guys! The information will no doubt cover topics that are not directly applicable to DATV, but if you want to get your feet wet this is a good opportunity. Topics will include the basics of COFDM modulation (which is also used in DVB-T,) single-frequency networks that allow multiple transmitters to operate on the same channel to reinforce one another rather than interfere with one another, portable \/ mobile DTV reception, new capabilities for emergency alerting functions and more.<\/p>\n
What’s equally important, at $50 this workshop (including breakfast and lunch) is dirt cheap!<\/i> The registration fee for professional workshops of this caliber are usually well into the hundreds of dollars range. The exact venue is TBD as it will depend on the number of registrants, but it will be in the Harrisburg area, making it an easy drive for most members of our group. Consider taking advantage of this opportunity to learn more about NextGenTV!<\/p>\n
73,
\nDan Rapak – WA3ATV<\/p>\n
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